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  • Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 02. 2010 12:15

Nine_Bullets
Ok, please do not construe the following as me whining or complaining. I do not pretend to
be good at this game, or an expert on its mechanics. I merely seek some clarification.

I need to understand what results I should be expecting as I move through the ranks of the
KM shipline. Until now, I have been playing under the assumption that things will get
better as my sailors level up, but it is coming increasingly obvious that that may not be
the case.

I'm in a Hipper right now with the following setup.

Hipper Setup:
CV Power Plant I - Heavy
CA Aiming FCS I
-lvl 48 X2 8"/60 SK C/34*
Bulkhead armor
LVL 53 Hvy gunners (vetted well for this level).

If I operate under the assumption that a successful game in this ship entails inflicting
more damage on the enemy that he inflicts upon you, then I would consider my progress to
be mediocre at best. Here's why:

- The KM shipline around this level (and basically throughout from what I can tell) is
designed to sit back and lob shells from outside the range of the enemy. KM ships are
noted for being quick and able to run. That's all fine and dandy, but my Hipper is slow as
can be (27knts cruising or 45knts overheat). A slow ship needs to be able to deter people
from getting close to it or avoid situations in which people may get close. This leads me
to my second problem...spreads. I understand that my gunners aren't high lvl, but with
that in mind, should I avoid getting into CA's until they lvl higher? My spread is simply
not sufficiently predictable to inflict enough damage on enemy CA's and CL's before they
are within range.


When my shells land on target they do acceptable amounts of damage, but remember this ship
with that setup fires 8 shells per salvo, and I am lucky to see 2 or 3 land in a pattern
that would damage the same ship (meaning regardless of shot placement, the most shells
I'll land on target is 2-3). This means that I must fire and fire and fire to do
significant damage to an enemy ship. Unfortunately, enemy ships need not do the same. My
Hipper with no armor quickly sees its demise when it is rushed by an enemy CA.

An obvious response would be to boost the gunner sailors...but this leads me to a bit of
an issue. What that would mean is that the only way to be successful at this level in
these types of KM ships is to have boosted or elite gunners. That, in my humble opinion,
would point to a significant flaw in this game.

So here's two questions for those with more experience than me:

1) How should I evaluate my gameplay results in terms of success or failure?

2) Are my points above built on faulty assumptions?

Any response is greatly appreciated.

-Nine
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  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 05. 2010 14:16

OttoReinhold
Ignore the 5.9" advices. The ship will work fine, especially if you upgrade it to PE soon. I got
myself 60 or 70 vets for each gunner (which were boosted elite reloaders to begin with) thanks
to the christmas event. In mid 50's with 8" guns I can't complain too bad about spread.
Sometimes you're unlucky and miss the entire salvo. Then again you're lucky and hit with 6 of 8
shells at max distance, where nobody can even hit you back. You can kite almost every ship. Just
stay clear of Deutschland/PPro. And if they rush you they're usually lighter. Then just gun em
down and don't get yourself torped.

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 04. 2010 22:11

DHamant
I went through the EXACT same thing you are going through. Let me tell you how to
spend the best $11 of your life.
1. Boost gunners - $5 (you already did that, sweet action)
2. Keep rookies full and continually try to convert experts until you have 60 vets -
free
3. Buy 1 +100 expert pack (it comes with 2 +100 expert boosts) and apply 1 to each
gunner - $2
4. Buy 2 +10 veteran packs (that means 4 +10 vet boosts) and apply 2 to each
gunner - $4
5. Enjoy

If you do this you should be good to go until you start getting serious about your BB
line, and then you'll drop a lot of money...

ALSO, do NOT be like all the other KM noobs and use the 5.9s on a Prinz Eugen. If
you ever want to be good at KM, you need to learn fast and early. This means
putting on eithers the dual 6.75"s or the 8"s and learning to keep the enemy at max
range ALL THE TIME. That means you're going to have to run... A LOT. Just get used
to it. I find myself running in my H44 from L2s all the time anymore...

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 04. 2010 19:44

aingeal
Oh yah?

And how do you like being raped silly by ANY correctly setup CL2?

A Mog CL with LHE will make mincemeat out of you, when leveling INJ I was laughing at my
mog ranging PE because they put on HHE.

If you really do not see the shell, boost the BO, or learn to aim without it. I never saw
my Mog CA shells land above angle 32, but still raped at max range lots of thing.

Learn to position your ship so you can use your range advantage, 45 knot is enough to keep
it for a while, and at that level, KM damage output is actually quite nice due to the
faster reload of their gunner.

If you put 5,9 on, just say hi to the cleveland when its going to rape you silly with 8" gun.

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 22:43

SA_Ka_20
I feel exactly the same... and BTW it's written everywhere on the forums : "use Light HE"

Wich is plain wrong... -_-
You earn 10cm range wich is nullified because of horrific dispersion... Then since it
weight as much as Heavy HE you can't put on more onboard and you're damage is divided by 2.
While on M-project I started to use light HE... seeing when, luckily, a shell landed on
ennemy ship it did poor damage, I switch to HHE. It increased my damage output, and I
started killing ennemies wich is a way of GREATLY increase your survivability.
In blitz... now in Gb I just try to shoot the occasional scout while hiding under clouds
since BB3456 prefer to shoot at me than other BB3456

I'm in a scharnhorst and i'm outranged and/or outdamaged by everything than can't rush me
(eccept other scharn, but they get raped like me before being in range)... I feel like
being food to others since i left ?ber Z99. :s

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 20:22

GravyFish
I don't know, I really like my Opro I. It's really fast and shoots as far as other
nations' BB4s. I have a much easier time holding my own between my AA, speed, and range
than my friend in his Colorado who doesn't have any range. I can't wait for my Opro II so
I can do some real damage. H39 and H44 don't look all that fun. I rarely see KM BB4 and 5
players excel in GB, though I know a couple of people that are great. I guess it just
takes a special touch to play without easy mode.

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 19:56

Jryder
"1) How should I evaluate my gameplay results in terms of success or failure?"

If I deal out more damage than I take I consider it a success. However, I've been playing
for a long time so I don't really consider it a true success unless I do A LOT more damage
than I'm worth (generally, at least 80-100K in BB3 or 100K+ for BB4/5).

"2) Are my points above built on faulty assumptions?"

No. Your spreads will almost always be inferior to what other nations are capable of even
with top notch gunners. Your damage will almost always be insufficient to stop charging
enemies even if you had a tight enough spread. Your "submergibility"+SD will never be
enough help to keep you from being one/two shot by other nations comparable BB's (Kaiser
may be lone exception). Your speed advantage disappears after BC2 (assuming that we still
have an advantage there...). Your range advantage is for all intents and purposes, a
marketing gimmick, especially in BB5.

The glory days of KM lie now in the BB2's and the now fixed BB3's. These are fun and
serviceable ships. They still have some of the traditional KM problems but at least they
have some speed and or decent firepower.

I agree with Wolverine. You are not far enough along or heavily invested enough (I hope)
to rule out dumping KM and starting another nation which will be far more fun to play.

(I myself am currently giving serious thought to selling/trading my KM BB5 crew and moving
on. KM is just too darn frustrating, especially when moving in to new KM ships seems all
too often to be a step DOWN rather than up...).

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 19:29

CLTwolverine
welcome to KM...

I'm in H39... Level 102 BO, Level 104 gunners... Elite BVE etc still can't get as
tight of spread as other nations with 16" L guns... range increase is barely
anything, most sihps are as fast as I am (3 Engin, 3 Rep, 1 scout), I get one
shotted all the time by Monty's, L2 and SY occasionally do... it is ugly...

worse still, I'm excited about getting to H44, but apparently the guns/shells it
has are still unreliable and you get out dueled with all bb5's and most bb4's...
the range advantage (all 2 mm) of it is nice, but doesn't balance out with the
pathetic damage shells cause in all KM ships, your lack of tight(clumped
spread), their complete lack of durability, and "speed advantage" which is non
existant...

Just keep plugging away, but remember, you are not so far along in that you
couldn't turn around and start a new nation that is not completely overmatched
in games...

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 18:29

Shroudlurk
Eh, I think he meant the 7" as 6.75", but the 6.75"s are really weak and shouldn't
be used for the Admiral Hipper. Also. there is no 40 degrees for the 8" and 6.75";
only 37 degrees. This guy should just leave his pointless advices elsewhere.

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 17:48

askldjgowirg
ok ijshorn, u know nothing about km just go away


there is no 7'' guns for km why would u use D set 5.9 on hipper when u have more than
enough space using L sets? and more so, why would u even use 5.9s?



anyway for host
hipper -> gneis was the toughest time during km as for my opinion, but don't worry about
these much, use ur AAs and range, stay out of other upper tier ship's range

  • Re : Understanding Efficient Ship Usage

    01. 03. 2010 14:14

ijshorn
go use 7 inch and 8 inch duals with not BVE gunners and you will get bad spread
most of the blits guys dont use range because they will get rushed by DD,s hole the
time i got every game a 80k + most of the times anyway you just need to evoid
brooklyns and your fine and 40 range angle is nice to avoid armor and the 7inch and
8 inch wont do any good when you only land 1 shell .
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