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  • Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman *UPDATED*

    12. 07. 2013 15:54

Recommend : 3

TG_Salihreis

** UPDATED **

Hello,

After some discussions under Kriegsmarine Forums, I came upon a possible setup for KM that makes your yatch reach rep cap with about 10minutes of overheat time. No kidding. Calculations are below. I would like to thank all of you for your time on reading this, and for all comments, reviews and thoughts.

 

Of couse, this's not perfect. The perfect crew would have 14x hero-boosted-vet capped-full expert sailors. Here is the general viev:


Pro's:

-Reaching rep cap without repairman,
-Maximum OH time ever,
-No delay classed engs, gunners or B.O. (only delay classed AA gunners and scout)
-Doesn't need full boosted hero crew,
-Doesn't need to vet cap all sailors.


Con's:

-Needs 8 hero sailors,
-Require many veterans and experts,
-It might be hard to adjust guidelines for BB6 B.O.
-Possible loss of Scout ability,
-Possible loss of AA Gunner ability.

 

For the ultimate crew, you need the following base sailors:

# 1x 14pot/12rep for B.O
# 8x Hero, (for engineers)
# 3x Elite Repair (for scout and AA gunners),
# 2x 11acc/11rel with 12 rep, (or 2x 10acc/10rel with 12 rep, altough this caps later, still you would want a 10/11 or 11/11 or 10/12 with 12 rep for WaW)
# 13 Boosts (for all, except B.O)



The sailors and their repair abilities.


KM B.O.

Bridge operator, Base: 14pot, 12 rep, LVL120 (13/12pot with12 rep will create more sane guidelines)
Repair 1453, Crew size 866, Vet cap 346,4
2'542'750 repair ability with 300 vet and 550 expert
(delay classing will keep BB6 guidelines shorter, also boosting can help with repair)
(see the post on the bottom of first page of this topic about delay capped B.O.)


KM Scout,
Ace Recon Pilot, Base: elite repair. Delay classed until LvL120 (boosted)
Repair 1572, Crew size 650, Vet cap 260
2'247'960 repair ability with 260 vet and 390 expert
(there is debate on boosting after classing or before classing)

KM AA Gunners
Chief Rapid Fire Gunners, Base: elite repair. Delay classed until LvL120 (boosted)
Repair 1572, Crew size 650, Vet cap 260
2'247'960 repair ability with 260 vet and 390 expert
(there is debate on boosting after classing or before classing)

KM Gunners
Chief gunners, Boosted. Base: 11acc/11rel with 12 rep. classed on time, LvL120
Repair 556, Crew size 1035, Vet cap 414
889'600 repair ability with 200 vet and 800 expert
(10acc/10rel with 12 rep would do the trick at bb6 level, but these cap later then 11/11)


KM Engineers
Chief engineers, Boosted. Base: Hero. classed on time, LvL120
Repair 1500, Crew size 972, Vet cap 388,8
3'000'000 repair ability with 350 vet and 600 expert

Total repair ability of this crew:
35'065'830



** UPDATED **

 

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 07. 2013 21:35


EricIdle

You propose to leave the BO at 100% crew?

With his overly long guidelines, you'll find he'll be quite useless to you.

And you prefer putting 300 vets on him rather than boosting him? lol

Further, there is absolutely no difference for the stats of your scout and AA gunners if "boosted after classing" (as you suggest) or boosted before. ... so you're not quite there yet...

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 07. 2013 21:55


TG_Salihreis

Originally Posted by EricIdle

You propose to leave the BO at 100% crew?

With his overly long guidelines, you'll find he'll be quite useless to you.

And you prefer putting 300 vets on him rather than boosting him? lol

Yeah guidelines will be too long... Of course why not boost him for some more ability? That can save some vets. If you care about guide lines being too long, you can start with a 14pot/12rep or 13pot/12rep sailor as a B.O.

Originally Posted by EricIdle

Further, there is absolutely no difference for the stats of your scout and AA gunners if "boosted after classing" (as you suggest) or boosted before. ... so you're not quite there yet...

In a classed-on-time sailor, boosting before or after classing makes no difference. But, yes there is a difference for delay classed sailors. Because, "boost works backwards".

 
Of course, boosting a national sailor (without a class) also helps with Repair ability and that mght be a plausible outcome. But there is the possibility of getting rid of the penalty of delay classing. Yes there is, AFAIK, and I confirmed this with moderators, (actually a moderator), "if you boost after delay classing, boost fixes the penalty of delay classing".  Interesting isn't it? Of course this can be a wrong information. But even if this was wrong, then that wouldn't hurt the repair ability outcome, you can reach repair cap without repairman.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 07. 2013 22:00


fromage

Originally Posted by TG_Salihreis

Yes there is, AFAIK, and I confirmed this with moderators.

lol

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 07. 2013 22:08


TG_Salihreis

Originally Posted by fromage

Originally Posted by TG_Salihreis

Yes there is, AFAIK, and I confirmed this with moderators.

lol

Yeah that doesn't sound good, I agree. But asking someone, who should have a fair knowledge about this game is not a bad idea IMHO. Anyway, you can reach repair cap without a repairman. Do you have objections to that?

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 07. 2013 22:18


EricIdle

Originally Posted by TG_Salihreis
Anyway, you can reach repair cap without a repairman. Do you have objections to that?

No objections with that. We only want you to get it right before you recommend this to other people.

For the BO, I'd actually recommend an elite repair that you only make a KM sailor and class BO much later (probably at BB4 stage - I haven't looked into this in-depth), so that you can just put him on support or t-slots to make levelling him easier.

You shouldn't be recommending getting 11/11 gunners with 12 repair - where do you find them??? If you suggest putting 200 vets on them, 10/10 gunners with 12 repair do the job perfectly, and are already easier to find. I would even consider elite repairs for that purpose.

My own KM crew will hit the repair cap at 120, but with "only" 109-259 vets on sailors.

What I like about your idea of a setup is the engineers that are classed earlier than 120 (in your case, classed on time). But with your setup you are looking at financial overkill.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 08. 2013 01:50


danita

Delayed classed elite rep BO will give you about 1.5-1.8 M TA rep if you class it at about BB4 lvl, more if you class later but it will probably require more vets to get the correct guideline length.
A pair of elite rep main gunners delayed classed ( not neccessarily at 120) should be able to give you about 3 M TA for the pair, if kept at the reload cap ( more if you keep em filled up). You will need more than  100 vets for that.
8 elite rep engineers with 200 vets delayed classed to engineers at 120 will give you 32 M TA with 4 minutes and change of OH.

Without repair contributions of the scout and t-slots I'm already well over the repair cap at 35 M TA.
 
It may not be a crew you can play from level 1 but imo it's more accessible than using 8 hero sailors and vet capping all sailors.
 
With good scout and AA gunner selection you will be able to class the engineers a bit earlier than 120 and gain some extra OH time.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 08. 2013 03:40


EricIdle

Originally Posted by danita

Delayed classed elite rep BO will give you about 1.5-1.8 M TA rep if you class it at about BB4 lvl, more if you class later but it will probably require more vets to get the correct guideline length.

Actually, according to NFcalc, there is no difference at all in repair ability between a BO classed on time and a BO late-classed at 120.

Other than that, I agree with danita's observations, especially on the usefulness of a setup and trying to be efficient in vet numbers.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 08. 2013 05:27


danita

Originally Posted by EricIdle

Originally Posted by danita

Delayed classed elite rep BO will give you about 1.5-1.8 M TA rep if you class it at about BB4 lvl, more if you class later but it will probably require more vets to get the correct guideline length.

Actually, according to NFcalc, there is no difference at all in repair ability between a BO classed on time and a BO late-classed at 120.

 



In practice there is.
Nfcalc gives you an end repair ability rating with a fully crewed BO.
You and I cut crew from the BO to keep the guidelines at max range.

Classing to BO never changes the repair ability growth. However the Potential growth will increase by 2 by classing it.
An elite repairer as nation sailor has 9 growth for potential and 13 for repair, an elite repairer as a BO has 11 growth for potential and 13 for repair.
So if you compare an ontime classed BO with a BO that is classed at say lvl 92, the on time classed BO has 160 total ability score ( to be multiplied by vets+ experts, corrected for crew percentage etc) more than the late classed BO, while their repair ability total remains the same.

A BB6 BO needs about 1.4-1.5 M TA potential to get the guidelines to the length of the max range of the guns.
Because the difference in growth speeds for Pot and rep are smaller for the ontime classed BO , it ends up with a slightly lower repair TA.

I put those numbers into Sk_bismarck's NFbuilder and made some fictional BO's, 1 classed on time the other at 92. At 120 with rookies removed to give the same potential TA:
Elite rep classed on time as BO ended up with 1.47 M TA potential and 1.74 M TA repair.
Delayed classed elite rep BO  ended up with 1.47 M TA potential and 2.01 M TA repair.

It's not a shocking difference, but every little bit helps.
Delaying the classing to 120 gives you  more repair obviously.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman

    12. 08. 2013 07:27


EricIdle

You are absolutely right. Thanks for this insight, danita.

I'm getting tempted now to level an elite repair as BO until BB4 ... 2 M instead of around 900k repair at 120 is really interesting. I'd get to 1.47 M TA potential for the guidelines at level 120 with an elite rep BO classed at lvl 96, with 120 vets and rest experts (full crew). Nicely doable.

That would mean that I can class my 8 support sailors earlier than at 120, without putting more than 259 vets on them.

OP's "update" is not good enough - still requires vet capping for too many sailors. OP is reticent to boost BO for no apparent reason - a boost is so much cheaper than taking vets from 200 to 300. And KM 10/10 gunners with 200 vets cap reload at around level 80 and acc many levels earlier, so there's no reason to go for 11/11 gunners with 12 repair.

  • Re : Reaching Rep Cap Without Repairman *UPDATED*

    12. 08. 2013 10:46


TG_Salihreis

Originally Posted by EricIdle

You are absolutely right. Thanks for this insight, danita.

I'm getting tempted now to level an elite repair as BO until BB4 ... 2 M instead of around 900k repair at 120 is really interesting. I'd get to 1.47 M TA potential for the guidelines at level 120 with an elite rep BO classed at lvl 96, with 120 vets and rest experts (full crew). Nicely doable.

I can suggest you a KM B.O, based on elite repairman.

1. Class KM sailor at lvl 12, then boost, so he gets 11 pot, 16 rep, 11 res,

2. Class B.O at lvl 103 (now he gets 13 pot, 16 rep, 11 res growth)

(103 is H44 LvL)

At LvL120, He will have a crew size of: 684 (vet cap at 273,6)
His potential will be:1380 and his rep will be:1920


With 129 Vets and 550 experts: he will have 1'471'080 Pot with 2'046'720 Rep

With 180 Vets and 500 experts: he will have 1'839'500 Pot with 2'342'400 Rep

With 250 Vets and 430 experts: he will have 2'051'750 Pot with 2'745'600 Rep

 

Another possible scenario:

1. Class KM sailor at lvl 12, then boost, so he gets 11 pot, 16 rep, 11 res,

2. Class B.O at lvl 89 (now he gets 13 pot, 16 rep, 11 res growth)

(89 is H39 LvL)

At LvL120, He will have a crew size of: 712
His potential will be:1415 and his rep will be:1920 (vet cap at 284,8)


With 129 Vets and 550 experts: he will have 1'508'390 Pot with 2'046'720 Rep

With 200 Vets and 500 experts: he will have 1'839'500 Pot with 2'496'000 Rep

With 250 Vets and 450 experts: he will have 2'051'750 Pot with 2'784'000 Repp

 


Another possible scenario:

1. Class KM sailor at lvl 12, then boost, so he gets 11 pot, 16 rep, 11 res,

2. Class B.O at lvl 55 1. (now he gets 13 pot, 16 rep, 11 res growth)

(55 is  Moltke lvl, P Pro 1 at lvl 54 does as good AAing as Moltke)

At BB4 level, he will have enough abilty to see where shells land, and provide enough guideline lenght.


At LvL120, He will have a crew size of: 780
His potential will be:1500 and his rep will be:1920

With 109 Vets and 550 experts: he will have 1'479'000 Pot with 1'893'120 Rep

With 129 Vets and 650 experts: he will have 1'749'000 Pot with 2'238'720 Rep

 

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