Community - Forum - View old data

Categories :  

Off-Topic

  Index

  • Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 14:18

LordKelvin
200 posts, you know what to do.

So, I know that I said this quite a while ago in the last thread, but now it's done. I
present:
  Index

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 16. 2010 14:39

fFoxfire
Well I did my FM duties also IF LK is going to to a GUNDAM posts then I guess its time to
crank out the DBZ Post.

-Fox

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 21:28

ComnderZero
the thread is now stickied

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 20:50

Menace1
Personally, I watched one episode of SEED and said no. I then went and watched some other
robot anime. I can't remember if it was SDF Macross, or Macross 7, or even Girls Bravo.
But I refused to waste 50 episodes worth of time on SEED.

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 19:13

normpearii
@jazzmeh Read the last line in the Gundam Seed Review....

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 16:44

LordKelvin
Because I haven't watched it...?

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 16:38

jazzmeh
you forgot to put GUNDAM SEED Destiny

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 15:40

crunch9876
haha

BURN!

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 15:12

LordKelvin
Says the person posting on an Internet forum about video games.

  • Re : Anime Thread #32

    11. 15. 2010 14:18

LordKelvin
LordKelvin's Master Gundam Review Index


After having watched almost every Gundam animated work (only two have escaped
review so far), I decided that it would be a good idea to plop down an entire post
where my opinion of all of them could be seen, for any future prospective Gundam
fans. It isn't quite a master review of all of Gundam since there are still two missing
(being G Gundam and SEED Destiny), but it's fairly close, I would say.

I'll be reviewing these in roughly Universal Century order, and then production order
for the non-UC series afterwards.


Mobile Suit Gundam (AKA Gundam 0079)


The progenitor of the franchise, released in 1979; there's not much that I can really
say here. Any true Gundam fan has to watch this out of obligation, in my opinion, if
only for the fact that none of Universal Century would make sense without it.
Granted, it's over thirty years old, making it older than anybody even reading this
thread, and doesn't compare at all to any of the animation today, but it's still a
classic, and despite its age it is still very good.

If you can choose between the movie and the series, pick the series. While the movie
does have better animation, it's in terms of notches, not steps; 1980 animation will
not look much better than 1979 animation. On top of which, some of the content that
was cut out to make the movie is plot-important; several conversations are assumed
to have happened anyways without actually happening, Amuro's fight with Chalia
Bull is the reason the Gundam got the magnetic coating upgrade, his duel with
M'quve is also an important fight in developing his Newtype abilities, and so on. The
movie does make a few changes that make the overall product step closer in the
Real Robot direction (such as removing the Guntank in the latter half and replacing it
with a second Guncannon, and removing the Gundam Hammer and G-Fighter
altogether, for example), but in the end it's still the original.

One thing that newcomers might have trouble with is understanding the overarching
plot. In this case, the movie does make some effort to explain the plot, but it's still
hard to follow despite that. In fact, this flaw foreshadows what you'll see in later
Tomino productions, where the plots and/or characters don't make complete sense,
though the grand scale of the overall story and universe is well-executed.


Gundam MS Igloo


MS IGLOO was supposed to be the Universal Century's star of the latter 2000s, with
the significant production budget and complete CGI animation, with Unicorn being the
post-2010 star. In truth, although it's nice to see GMs and Zakus duking it out in full
720p CGI, much of the action falls to "style over substance." The dialogue and
overarching story are rock-solid since it's based on the One Year War, and it does
execute the "war is hell" theme quite convincingly, but the action scenes are over the
top whenever they do happen. In particular, there's no reason that a GM should self-
destruct at high speeds if they aren't able to reach such high speeds in the first
place, the Big Rang being able to simply grab a Ball and toss it at two others
perfectly despite being piloted by an Engineering Lieutenant with no combat
experience, is not very convincing. This isn't to say that they aren't awesome, but
when put side-by-side with the OVA's theme, it doesn't jostle right.

It is most certainly worth a watch, especially since there are only nine episodes, but
in all honesty you would probably have to watch Universal Century up to CCA to truly
appreciate it, though at a minimum you just need to watch 0079 to get most of it. I
would personally recommend watching 0079 first and then this though, because
that's all you really need. On top of which, because some of the episodes take place,
chronologically, before the events in 0079, they take the effort to explain the plot in
some detail, which can help newcomers to come to terms with the Universal Century.


The 08th MS Team


The 08th MS Team certainly has lots of fans, and for good reason: it is the most well-
executed "Real Robot" of all of Universal Century. There are no Newtypes, no flashy
battles between custom mobile suits, with realistically-portrayed characters and the
overall commanders on both sides being close to complete monsters. Yes, there are
Gundams, but they are portrayed as realistically vulnerable to destruction despite
their superior performance if ambushed or faced with a skilled opponent. It's still a bit
campy and the dissonance between the war theme and the Romeo and Juliet theme
can cause some confusion at times, but otherwise, it is a well-executed member of
the franchise. My opinion is, you can like the romantic opposite-sides plot, or you can
like the Vietnam-esque war theme, but it's hard to like both at the same time.

The additional interquel, Miller's Report, really isn't anything special, it mainly adds
about twenty minutes' worth of review dialogue, but largely uses footage from the
rest of the series in flashbacks or simply straight-copy. If the transition during Shiro's
inquiry doesn't make much sense to you then this can help clear it up a little, but
otherwise it just fills some small potholes that you probably wouldn't notice going
over anyways.


Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket


This one holds a place close to my heart, since 0080 was the very first exposure I
had to Gundam (when I was eight), and my very first 1/100 Master Grade model was
the NT-1 Alex. 0080 is an excellent addition to the story, because even if it only really
has a handful of action scenes (and out of which only two are important), it's not an
action OVA, it's a reminder that people really do die in war and that war does change
people. The OVA does execute its theme well, but its only real flaw is that Al (the
protagonist) seems a little too gung-ho in trying to be a part of war, more so than
one could reasonably expect of a kid his age. Perhaps the writers had to force it a
little in order to make the plot work, or perhaps children in Japan are simply that
different, but overall it's only really a minor flaw in the execution.

One of the nice things about this OVA is that, since it's the end of the One Year War,
the suits that are used in battle aren't your standard GMs, Zakus, and Gelgoogs;
they're limited-production upgrades that you don't see later on because they came
too little too late in the case of Zeon, and simply not worth the additional effort
because they're already winning for the Federation. In the case of the Kampfer, it
never even reached limited production. Again, the action sequences are a bit limited,
but it falls in fairly well with the OVA's theme.

At only six episodes, it's well worth a watch. You just have to remember that the
purpose of this OVA isn't necessarily to watch mobile suits duke it out, but rather
what effect that fighting truly has on people.


Gundam 0083: Stardust Memory


Something of an interquel between 0079 and Zeta Gundam, 0083 really stands out
among its peers because of its quality fight scenes. It's flashy and focuses on fleet
battles and individual mobile suit battles and battles between egos, but it does all
that in a classy style that's well-executed. There are space battles, Gundam vs.
Gundam battles, and general backstabbing between various sides, but it's all
meshed together well and the end product is truly something to behold.

There's only really one minor flaw, and one thing to keep in mind, though. As an
interquel, you have to watch Zeta Gundam to understand certain characters'
motivations, or even to understand who certain characters are. As for flaws, the love
triangle between Nina Purpleton and Gato vs. Kou can make you go "huh?" in a few
places, but otherwise does not negatively impact the overall product that much.

If you like grand space battles with beam cannons shooting everywhere, mobile suits
getting up close and personal, characters with multiple agendas, and larger-than-life
duels between Gundams and mobile armors, you'll definitely love 0083.


Mobile Suit Zeta Gundam


Ah, this. Lots of hard-line UC fans seem to love Zeta Gundam, but I just can't bring
myself to like it no matter how hard I try. Besides SEED, Zeta Gundam is probably
one of the crappier entries in the franchise.

My very first impression when starting this series was, "Yay, I get to see Amuro,
Char, and Bright animated in 80's animation!" but then it just went completely
downhill from there. It is next to impossible to like any of the main characters in the
series besides those three; sure, there's exceptions like Emma Sheen, but when just
about every other character makes you want to step in and throttle them because of
their stupidity, it's hard to enjoy this series. Much of the "main" cast (including
Kamille) either make extremely stupid decisions based off of nothing at all, punch or
slap each other for no reason, and generally act in the same manner as neurotic
rabies-infected dogs that should have been put down long ago. It says a lot when I
started laughing every time a main character such as Reccoa or Katz died, rather
than feel sorry for them.

About the only real good thing that Zeta had going for it was its loads of mobile suit
designs, most if which were no slouch. Though some of them seem more aesthetic
than actually purpose-designed for combat, and the wide range of colors makes it
seem much less like a "Real Robot" series, just the sheer volume of designs is
impressive.

That, however, falls more or less on its face when the characters who pilot those
suits don't seem to improve their skills at all, but rather rely on the suit to do the
work for them. Even throughout the supposed rivalry between Kamille and Jerrid,
neither of them seemed to learn anything new about how to pilot their mobile suits,
and fought each other more or less just the same in their first fight as in their last,
with variations only due to what each suit could specifically do (such as using certain
weapons or transformation systems).

Besides the characters pitfall though, Zeta's other major fault was a complete lack of
plot. This is where you really learn that Tomino can't write plots worth crap; you
aren't told why the Argama is going to conduct this attack, why some of the
characters are suddenly going down to Earth, how the overall conflict is progressing,
why Neo Zeon decided to crash Axis into A Baoa Qu, why Paptimus Scirocco decided
to do something or other, and so on. It's at this point that you realize that the series
simply serves as a wrapper for the mobile suits, and everything else acts as a filler
inbetween, including the characters. Even the overall plot, not just stepping between
events, is not written very well.

My final verdict is that, were it not to contain plot-important elements necessary to
watch anything set after it, this is definitely a series that you should skip. It's not
worth the aggravation of watching stupid characters do something that causes their
own death later on, or the general angst that pervades the entire series.


Mobile Suit Gundam ZZ


This is the only reason that I can even forgive Zeta for existing, because this series is
superior to it in just about every way. It has likable characters, the plot follows
somewhat more easily, and the comedy in the first half of the series is an instant
cure for all the crap that Zeta piled on me.

While most of the new characters are just kids, like Kamille in Zeta, the biggest
difference here is that they actually do something other than feel sorry for
themselves or angry at adults for doing perfectly reasonable things. In fact, they
manage to accomplish a hell of a lot more than much of Zeta's cast did, with fewer
resources at hand. While they have about the same amount of depth as characters
from Zeta, they're a hell of a lot easier to understand, and their motivations aren't
completely random.

There aren't as many new suit designs in Double Zeta as there are in Zeta, but it's
still a wide and impressive range. Unlike in Zeta though, the entire series doesn't
serve as a wrapper for the suits, and because there are actual characters piloting
those suits, it doesn't suffer from the pitfalls that Zeta did.

Double Zeta is most probably my favorite entry in the entire franchise. It's funny, it
has characters that you can identify with, it has excellent suit designs, the plot
makes sense, and best of all, it has a super awesome theme song. It definitely gets
a thumbs-up from me.


Mobile Suit Gundam: Char's Counterattack


Some people consider this to be the definitive end of Universal Century (besides
Unicorn), since F91 and Victory take place 30 and 60 years later, respectively. As the
culmination for the saga of Char and Amuro, it's a must-watch by default, really, but
that's not saying that it isn't good on its own.

The main thing that drew me to this movie was seeing Amuro as a bad-ass pilot who
put everything he learned in the last two wars to good use and became probably the
most skilled Gundam pilot to ever grace the Gundam multi-verse. After watching 0079
and then Zeta, you realize that this is the same guy who battered his way through
surviving in the RX-78-2, to becoming so skilled that the RX-78-2 could barely keep
up with him, to building his own custom Gundam to save the world. Of course, there's
also Char, and really you can't hate Char even if he decides to drop asteroids onto
Earth for reasons that only he truly understands. These two larger-than-life
personalities form the core of this movie, which, while short, is still very well-done
and rightly serves as the pinnacle of the universe.

About the only real flaw with the character cast is that Tomino tried, again, to force a
love plot into it, which sidelines Quess and Hathaway as being obstacles to the
movie. Hell, were Quess not the pilot of the Alpha Azieru, it truly would have been
inconsequential had they not been in the movie at all.

While CCA features very unique suit designs, the main problem is that there are so
few of them; the grunts are limited to GM IIIs and Jegans versus Geara Dogas, and
there are only a handful of other mobile suits that are reserved for the elites. The
designs and battles are nice, but how about more than just one or two types of
mobile suits duking it out in the battles that aren't super-climactic?

The fight scenes, besides the final few of the movie, are well-done, but really not on
the same scale as 0083. They're short, brutal, and exciting, but not to the same level
of class as many of the ones that took place during Operation Stardust.

Overall, it's a well-done movie, if a little rushed simply due to the fact that it's a
movie. Again, one of my long-standing opinions, it's far better to make an OVA than a
movie because otherwise you're trying to cram too much into too little time, and the
overall product suffers for it.


Mobile Suit Gundam F91


This one is infamous because it got crammed from a 50-episode series into a 2-hour
movie, and that's just the first 13 episodes of it. The final product feels completely
rushed, the plot makes sense only if you pause here and there to think about it and
fill some holes, and the characters don't have time to develop. Despite its strengths,
this movie still ends up closer to the bottom end of the list than the top because it
was forced to try too much with too little.

That said, the animation quality and designs are top-notch, especially for a new entry
in the series. The first of the series to introduce miniaturized mobile suits with high-
output generators, it really shows the potential that the movie had to revolutionize
the Universal Century. What fight scenes there are, are done beautifully, probably to
the same class as 0083 if not better. The drawback is that there are so few of them
since it's a movie instead of an OVA.

In the end, this movie really is only an indicator of what a full-length series could
have been, and it truly is a shame that it wasn't allowed to be completed as a series
or even an OVA. At two hours, it won't take up much of your time, and is probably
worth it if only for the animation and fight scene quality.


Mobile Suit Victory Gundam


Tomino's last production before Turn A, I do have to say that this series does earn its
hype as opposed to Zeta. It's set in a unique new universe, much like F91, but it
actually got the chance to grow and expand, which is to its fortune. For being so
different from other UC entries, Victory does stand out in terms of quality and style.

Despite its similarities to Zeta, what made Victory bearable to me was that the
characters aren't idiots that are easy to hate. Rather to the contrary, it's rather easy
to empathize with the protagonists, and even the antagonists can be understood to
a degree. The overall plot is somewhat depressing, to be sure, but rather than rail
against the cast and hope for it to end quickly, it's actually possible to cheer the
protagonists on to victory.

The style of the designs used in Victory can be echoed from F91 in that, for the first
time in a while, you don't see mobile suits that are based off of Zakus or GMs. Of
course, you have to have one that resembles the RX-78-2 because it's a Gundam
series, but even that was executed fairly well, since the V Gundam seems to combine
many of the best features of the RX-78-2, the Zeta, and the Double Zeta all into one
deadly little package. And when you get to the V2 Gundam, it just gets better.

Like previous Tomino productions, Victory suffers a bit from the lack of a clearly-lined
plot, but it still manages to hold its own, which is especially meritable since it didn't
have the One Year War to fall back on. In fact, Tomino manages to go one better
with a distinct lack of stock footage, probably a first for the franchise.

Overall, Victory is exactly as its name states, a victory in the Gundam franchise. It
definitely stands in its own class, and while not everybody will like it, I certainly did,
and I would most certainly recommend it.


Mobile Suit Gundam Wing


Gundam Wing: the series that first truly introduced many of us to the Gundam
universe. It gets a lot of backlash because of its supposedly emo character design,
but much of that is unjustified. There's a good reason why lots of people remember
Wing in such a good light, after all.

What truly made Wing so distinct from the rest of Universal Century was that the
characters could stand as entities of their own, rather than just as the guy who
pilots your favorite mobile suit. Each character has their own characteristics, their
own relationships with others, the whole nine yards. Rather than simply serving as a
wrapper for mobile suit fights, the series has its own dramas that are well-executed
even without the need for a mobile suit.

That all being said, the suit designs themselves are actually among the most shallow
in the franchise. Besides G Gundam, it really does truly emphasize "style over
substance," which is rather odd considering that Kunio Okawara is the one who
designed most of the suits for this series. The suits definitely perform, but they lack
the depth that Universal Century mobile suits have, and it's a bit hard not to see the
resemblance to Dynasty Warriors.

The suit designs, however, don't really matter at all since the plot is, likely because it
wasn't written by Tomino, fairly straightforward to follow and easy to understand.
This isn't to say the plot is shallow, but rather that the writers took the time to make
sure that the viewer understood why certain things were happening. This, combined
with the well-written characters, is the main reason why Gundam Wing ranks so high
in the pantheon of Gundams. It's well-written, well-executed, with memorable
characters that stand beyond simply being a Gundam pilot. This one is a no-brainer
must-watch.


After War Gundam X


Maybe it simply had the misfortune to follow Gundam Wing, but that's no reason to
discount this series. While it can be aptly summarized as a mix of Gundam Wing and
post-apocalyptic Universal Century, it really stretches far beyond just that. And, since
my very first Gundam model ever was a 1/144 Gundam X, this series is a bit special
for me as well.

Gundam X really takes many of its strengths from Wing: characters that are written
to be more than just a mobile suit pilot, combined with a plot that doesn't rely on you
stretching your imagination to fill in the holes. To that, it adds the additional
strengths of excellent mobile suit designs (though albeit some seemingly lifted
straight out of Wing, but incidental considering that the work here was also done by
Okawara), and many more of them, though still a bit shallow in comparison to
Universal Century.

There aren't really any true weaknesses to this series besides the forced ending.
Unlike Wing, it doesn't hesitate to pull out the light moments where everyone can
laugh and relax, and it still manages to retain the memorable characters. And even
the ending, while a little rushed, still ends up well-written given the circumstances. I
would definitely recommend this series to everybody, even those who loved Wing.
Just because BanDai doesn't like it, doesn't mean that you don't have to either.


Turn A Gundam


Tomino's last production for Gundam, and arguably his best for the franchise, which,
after watching it, I would have to agree with.

As I said before, the show seems to suffer from lackluster animation in its first five or
ten episodes, but after that it really picks up nicely. The style and animation, are
unique, far more in their own class than Victory, and it really shows. Some people
decide not to watch this series simply because the Turn A Gundam was designed by
Syd Mead, but really that's to their misfortune; the designs really enhance the plot in
a way that nothing else can.

The characters, if it can be said, are possibly among the best ever in any Gundam
series to date, especially noticeable given that this is a Tomino series. What's even
better is that Tomino actually avoids killing all of them, so that in the end the only
main characters who do die are the bad guys and two or three good guys. They
might not be to the same depth as Wing or X, but they certainly stand out in their
own way.

As with previous Tomino productions, the tracing plot can be hard to understand at
times, but it's nothing to get bent out of shape over this time. The occasional "huh?"
can be had here and there, but overall, especially compared to Zeta and Victory, it's
far easier to follow.

There's nothing that really stands out in Turn A Gundam, but that's really because
everything is so well-rounded and still above average. Excellent plot, excellent
characters, excellent machine design, excellent animation after the first 10 episodes,
pretty much excellent everything. A definite must-watch in my book, despite only
having been in my book for barely a month.


Gundam SEED


Gundam SEED: next to Zeta Gundam, the only truly black mark in the book.

What's there to be said about this series? Bad animation, gratuitous fanservice,
completely overused stock footage, stupid characters that you probably couldn't give
two craps about... and that's just off the top of my head. For something that
supposedly uses digital animation, I should have a right to expect better, especially
since it's post-2000. When the cel-animated series that came before manage to do
better, then there really is no excuse.

Anything that I didn't like about SEED the first time I watched it back in '03 or so, was
only really amplified upon rewatching it last year. I can forgive lifting ideas off of
previous Gundam plots since all of them do that to one extent or another, but when
you wrap it around a sub-standard product that only really caters to 15-year olds,
then you have a problem. In summary:



Note: this only really applies to SEED since I haven't watched SEED Destiny, but
given what I've read about Destiny, I don't think that my disposition can improve by
watching it.


Gundam 00


The newest entry in the franchise, minus Unicorn, which isn't complete. I'd have to
say, this series is also quite strong in almost every compartment, except for the plot.
The characters are memorable, the suit designs are unique and interesting, the
animation quality is definitely top-notch (they even managed to avoid the use of
stock footage for most of it), and so on; truly a Gundam series worthy of its time.

The only real problem comes from the writers not being able to decide what kind of
story they wanted to tell. When you look at the huge break between the first season
and the second, it's almost like two completely different series. Lots of the characters
change quite a bit, the surrounding universe has taken a complete turn, characters
introduced in the second season can't be easily explained away, and probably most
egregious, the ending. This isn't to say that 00 is bad, far from it, but the plot is
probably its weakest link where everything else is rather strong.


Overall, I would peg the Gundam franchise as one that truly deserves the fame and
popularity it has garnered over the decades, even the lesser members of the
franchise. For expanding on a single not-so-popular 43-episode series from 30 years
ago, and still being a juggernaut to this day, it's not hard to imagine that Gundam's
popularity will continue for more years to come.
1 2 3 4 5 6