

Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:19 PST
 Recommend : 6
normpearii

I have reposted Adalbert's great guide here, due to the fact that the Old forum data does not correctly order the post. Which renders to most people the guide unreadable since some people can't understand reading post in reverse.
To help ease confusing, this guide is reposted here until the Old Forum Data is reordered to how it was originally on the old forum. This post will then be deleted. Or if the great Adalbert returns, this post will be deleted so he can repost himself and update if he desires.
Note some information in this guide is out dated, but as a whole is the most correct guide on ability and caps we currently have a very valuable asset to any player level and grinding sailors.


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:19 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
As all my "formulaposts" have been recently bumped, I was approached to put them all into one post so it could be stikied... here it is.
These guides contain advanced information. If you are just starting to play the game please go ahead and read Obst's guides on www.nfguides.com. That webpage gives you all the information you need to start with. If you have done that and are still curious about some details, go read ahead.
Since it has quite some information, I divided it into several parts, that are posted as replies by myself.
0) Ability  how they are calculated / base stats 1) BO's Potential  guideline length / marking distance 2) Accuracy  where's the cap, how is it calculated 3) Reload  where's the cap 4) Torpedo  reload cap 5) AAW  chance of shooting down planes at horizontal and vertical distances with auto fire 6) Repair  Repairrate and Burnrate 7) Restore  SD 8) Engine . A  General . B  Overheat time . C  Base speed . D  natural overheat speed . E  overheat speed with crew 9) Aircraft  not yet posted 10) Fighter  not yet posted 11) Bomber  not yet posted 12) Special Sailors . A  Sonarmen
If you have questions or remarks to any of those posts  please send a PM to me. Also if you think that you have found a mistake, please contact me directly as it most probably will just be a misunderstanding and I don't want an obsolete discussion in this post as it just blows it up and might scare ppl away. I have not included all "proof" in this post  if you are looking for some numbers how I came up with the formulas, feel free to look for my old posts from between 2005 and now, and you will find more information in there.


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:19 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
0) Ability =======
Ability is what effects the performance of every sailor in Navyfield. If you are new to the game or have general questions on what ability which sailor should be good in, please refer to Obst guides infact I think every player should read or have read them.
*** www.nfguides.com ***
Now to how ability is calculated in the game for a SINGLE SAILOR  it is more then just the displayed value.
With N(vets) = number of veterans N(experts) = number of experts N(tot) = total number of sailors = rookies + experts + veterans N(max) = maximum number of sailors (as displayed)
****** I will be referring to this true ability in all further guides. Remeber  you have to calculate your every's sailors ability with the formula above if you want them to work. ******
Since SDE recently introduced that ability percentage of every sailor is shown you can also calculate the true ability by
(skill percentage * displayed ability * max crew),
which is mathematically identical.
Now some immediate conclusions that we can draw from that formula.
1) keep your sailors maxed out at all times  reducing the number of rookies not only decreases the chance to get more experts, but also reduces the sailor's true ability, thus making him perform worse.
2) Class all sailors right when a promotion becomes available. Not only do you loose the extra ability bonus when you don't, but usually the recruit gain per level increases after a promotion. And as you can see the mere number of experts and vets influences the performance of a sailor and not the displayed ability percentage directly. { exception : pilots loose recruit gain per level after promotions }
1) BO Potential ===========
A higher value on potential for the BO lets your guidelines grow and mark shells further. The marking range of the FCS is the only other variable that matters for guideline length. Your guideline length in tickmarks is :
> 11.1 * (true BO potential / 1000000) + 12.6 * marking range {km} <
So the marking range only gives you another starting length of the guidelines, the BO's potential needed to get one more tickmark (90k true ability) stays the same for all ships, guns and FCS's.
2) Accuracy ========
Sayoyin has made the discovery where to find all those values and spend an immense amount of time and effort in finding formulas that describe it. You can find his whole explanation under http://www.navyfield.com/board/view.asp?Num=94981&Sort=D07 I have just shortened it and rearranged the interpretation for better understanding. Give him the reccomendation for his work on accuracy.
Now the best part :
Yes, there is an accuracy cap. You reach it when your gunners true accability is
> 4706 * lvl of gunners + 1000000 <
It is independent from your ship, FCS, guns or whatever else. Once you have reached that value, your gunners do not get better accuracy by adding vets for example.
If you start with a +10 gunner, boost him and give him 100 vets (which seems to be normal allready), your gunners will be at the accuracy cap surprisingly soon. Here are some numbers  all +10base, boosted, 100vets sailors.
UK ACC gunner  lvl63 UK rel gunner  lvl85 KM Gunner  lvl64... and the others are in between.
Now that is only the cap. And if you have looked sharply  there is the level of your gunners as a factor in the formula. Meaning  the cap increases every level. (your gunners accuracy just increases faster then the cap, so once you have hit it  you stay over it)
Your spread however is determined by the accuracy itself, which is a number calculated by :
Accuracy = (FCS + GunRev) * ((3 * true ability /1000000) + 1)
Where "FCS" is the accuracy revision of your FCS and "GunRev" is the accuracy revision of every gun. Most of them are 0  the guns that block have that value set to 25.
So what determines your spread now :
1) FCS 2) The Guns accuracy Revision (assume 0 for the guns that don't block for now) 3) Your gunners true ability UP TO THE CAP. < there's the catch (Once your gunners have reached the cap, there is nothing you can do to make them better except level up to increase the cap value)
The FCS has by far the greatest effect on your spread. The part that is affected by your crew makes up only around 35% of the final accuracy value.
3) Reload =======
Reload is capped at 50% of the published gunreloadvalue for boosted gunners and slightly above for unboosted ones. Once you have reached the cap, your reload will stay the same, no matter how high your ability goes (well.. that's why they call it a cap). Reload speed is generally linear to true reload ability with small discontinuities. So if you reload 10 seconds one day, gain 10000 true ability the next day and get down to 9 seconds, then another 10000 true ability will give you 8 seconds and so on until you reach the cap. However if you watch the reloadclock at the bottom of your screen, you will notice that the indicator on it doesn't run smoothly but 'jumps' a little. So you can reach a point where loosing one recruit could mean a 1 second longer reload time  however this is generally unsignificant. The value to reach the cap is NOT dependent on FCS, ship, gun level, nation and only minute to the gun used. In most cases it is at :
> 2070k true reload ability <
*** NOTE the true reload ability cap is no longer 2070k ***
for faster reloading guns (like most AA guns) due to smaller steps in their reload process it can be as low as 1950k true reload ability.
*** NOTE the new low caliber true reload ability cap is ~2600k, courtesy of pyrofiend. ***
Now the required level to reach the reload cap for selected gunners (100 vets, rest experts, boosted, +10 reload base)
UK rel gunner : lvl58 / UK acc gunner : lvl113 UK AA gunner : lvl120 at +12 base with 190 vets or better... KM gunner : lvl83 / KM AA : lvl90
4) Torpedo ==============
The reload time of Torpedos is only determined by true torpedo ability of the Torpedo man firing the torps. It is capped at 50% of the published base reload and you reach it with all torplaunchers of any nation at around 850k true torpedo ability  so pretty early. A bve IJN Torper with +10 base growth reaches it at lvl51.
5) AAW =====
A not that efficient stat right now  more on this in a 'while'


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:19 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
6) Repair ======
The repair stat is responsible for rate of repair and the rate of burning.
 All Sailors aboard your ship contribute to repairrate and stack linear, no matter on which position  Repairrate is capped at 280DP/sec which you reach with 35mil true repair ability
Calculate the repair ability for every sailor aboard and add them up. I have dropped the actual formula for repairrate, as it is discontinuous and not linear and might be a bit confusing to look at. Instead here is a graph that gives you the repairrate for given values of repair ability.
and the same graph for higher abilities to make it easier to read :
***LOST IMAGE***
Don't forget the BO in your calculations!! You can see his (unboosted) abilities every time he levels up.
Now to the burnrate  meaning the rate at which you loose DP while burning. Here's the graph :
not too important as you get above 5,500,000 repair ability quite fast and it is capped there at 25DP/sec  even at 55,000,000 ability (my crew with extra reps) it is still the same.
7) Restore ========
The restore stat contributes to Soft Defense (SD), nothing else. Smedd posted the first conclusions on SD on the NAservers. After reducing the SD cap, altering the way it was calculated increasing the cap again... it is all back to the way it was when I started playing the game.
If you don't know HOW it works in general  read Obst guides again... I'm going into more detail here.
1) Every sailor aboard your ship contributes to SD (even the BO) and stack linear 2) Restore ability is the one that matters here 3) You can have a maximum of 900SD 4) Restorers get a bonus in that ability and produce the most SD of all sailors. Eventually you will hit 900SD without a single restorer through the comined abilities of the other sailors.
Now to the calculation
or if you don't remember what I said in the first post about ability :
For our young folks confused by mathematical symbols... just calculate SD for every single sailor aboard and add them up.
If you have 100SD you will take only 90% instant damage of a hit and burn 10%  thus giving time to repair. Effectively to kill you in one 'hit' you would need 110% of the damage of what your ships DP is. It goes up linear to 900SD and is capped there. Just take a look at the graph :
***LOST IMAGE***
You can clearly see the cap at 900SD. Although my formula will give you the values for SD even above 900, it has NO further effect anymore once you reach that value.
SD also helps your ship to repair further. So if you take damage with 0 SD you will loose 20% of that hit on your DP which you will not be able to repair. With increasing SD this value drops and is capped at 900SD, where you only take about 2.2% permanent damage (the little red arrow on the health bar shows you how far you can repair)  again a picture :
An example  you have a ship with 20000DP, a crew with 500SD and get hit by an evil ship wich gets 10000attack from it. 1) You take 50% immediate DP reduction = which brings you down to 20k5k=15k DP 2) if you had no repair ability you would burn the remaining 5k down to 10k DP 3) you will be able to repair until you hit your prior DP minus 10% of the hit or 1k bringing you back up to 19k DP


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:20 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
8) Engine ======= The engine ability is a little more complex, so this topic is divided into parts A : Basics B : Overheat time C : base speed D : natural overheat speed E : overheat speed with crew ** A ** Basics  ONLY engineers contribute to overheat speed and time  They only work in the support slots or BO slot of premium ships  It is only the true engine ability (calculated as shown prior in this guide) that matters for these calculations ** B ** Overheat time  The maximum overspeed is limited to 70 percent above the 'base speed'. Different ships need a different amount of engis to get to the max speed. (thanks SirDante for that cap Info)  Engine ability stacks linear for overheat time and all engis. You can calculate your overheat time for every sailor or for all your engineers using : remember again... calculate the true engine ability for all the engineers aboard your ship and simply add them up. The result value is the number of seconds that you can overheat extra  meaning you have to add it to your engines base overheat time. And it does NOT matter which engine, which ship  the amount of 'overheat seconds' added by your engineers stays the same. Don't rely on the released values for engine overheat time too much as they are sometimes off by 1 or 2 sec  just run your ship without an engineer and stop the overheat time. Thanks chagrin for that input, now all values are close to 100 percent correct. And here's a little graph showing how much a single engineer actually does. I did it for boosted +12base KM,+12base UK engi, a +10 UK with 100 vets and a 'normal' growth of experts, as well as for +10UK non boosted and even without vets  just to compare.


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:20 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
** C ** Base speed
The base speed of a ship (yes I know you can all see it  but for the overspeed calculations it will prove necessary) can be calculated
with HP beeing the horsepower of the engine you equip, DP the Displacement of your ship and DPstandard.. well the standard DP that you can find in the tables (www.trainworld.us for example). C(ship) is a constant value that is different for each ship.
Extracting this constant from ingamedata is VERY time consuming and it is subject to change with lots of patches. Reading it out of the data files might get you in conflict with SDE.
You can see in the following graph that the constant C is only dependent on the ship and not on the engine as the values for the shown selected ships are overlapping no matter what engine is used.
Some values for C are :
Fletcher : 3758 Timmermann : 6137 Lion2 : 25658
LordKelvin has made the effort to extract 'c' for all US ships. You can find it here : http://www.navyfield.com/board/view.asp?Num=111152&Sort=A01
** D ** natural overheat
Natural overheat is the speed that your ship is able to overheat to if you have no engineer on board.
with the overheat ratio beeing the product of the engine overspeed ratio and the ships overspeed ratio. You can see the Ships overspeed ratio when buying a a new ship and the engines overspeed ratio as the percentage behind the horsepower when buying an engine. For example Lion2 with the heavy BB5 engine Ships overheat ratio = 28% Engines overheat ratio = 120% > Overheat ratio = 0.28*1.2 = 0.336
Important here is, that you only disregard anything behind the second digit after the decimal. So in the existent case, it would be 0.33 only. Also you have to round the result down to the next full number.
So with a base speed of 23 knots your natural overspeed would be 23*(1+0.33) = 30.59 > 30 knots.


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:20 PST
normpearii

Originally Posted by Adalbert
** E ** Overheat speed with crew
Thanks to a few (really only a few unfortunately) members that actually were interested in what I wrote here and took some time to try to help I've decided to post this formula here finally as well. SoloAD from the russion server found a really easy interpretation which I am going to present here rather then my exponential expression  so thanks for that. ******
To get the overheat speed with engis on board, we just need to ammend the overheat ratio from the topic above with the engineers' ability.
With : OHR_ship = Overheat Ratio of the ship used OHR_engine = Overheat Ratio of the engine used And the sum over N_engineers means nothing else then that you have to calculate the true ability for every engineer on board and then add it up. The same like with all other formulas on here before really... N finally is the number of engineers on board.
It still remains, that you have to round down your result and also only use two 'after decimal digits' of (OHR_Ship * OHR_engine). And the overheat speed is calculated simply by
just as stated before.
****** EXAMPLE ********* Yamato with 'normal' crew, b/v/e with filled up sailors.
Yamato  overheat ratio 23% BB V hvy engine OH ratio 120%
Crew (rookies, experts, vets, max crew, displayed engine ability, true ability /1000) Engi 1 lvl93 +12 base (50,540,108,698,2549,2477) Engi 2 same like Engi1 Engi 3 lvl80 +11 base (50,440,104,594,2065,1767)
Base Speed = 24 knots
With Engi 1 alone you get :
24 * (1+0.23*1.2+2477/18000) = 24* (1 + 0.27 + 0.1376) = 33.78 = 33knots
Engi 3 alone gives you only :
24* (1+0.23*1.2+1767/18000) = 32.83 = 32knots
Having both Engi1 and Engi3 makes it :
24*(1+ 0.23*1.2 + (2477+1767)/(18000*sqrt(2)) = 24* (1+0.27+4244/25456) = 34 knots
All three give you
24*(1+ 0.23*1.2 + (2477+2477+1767)/(18000*sqrt(3)) = 35.65 = 35 knots
I hope you get the idea... and you can just make a small tool to calculate it for you. Even an excel worksheet works well for it. ***********************
The overspeed formula leads to another interesting result regarding the stacking of engineers. For overheat speed it's obviously not linear like it is for overheat time.
The 1st engi works to 100% of his ability (no surprise) Adding a second engi  makes BOTH engis aboard only effective to 71%  or more precice to 1/sqrt(2)= 70.71..% 3rd engi : all work at 1/sqrt(3) = 57.73% 4th engi : 50% 5th engi : 44.72% and so on...
Mixing engineers of different levels may reduce your overheat speed. If you have one engi with 2000 ability that let's you overheat at 34 knots and another one with 200 ability and you put them on the same ship, the combined ability will be only (2000+200)*0.707=1556 or LESS then the better engi alone. Meaning you could loose a knot of overspeed.
If you have engis of the same true ability (same level, base and crew pretty much) there is another way to interprete the data:
let's see if someone understands what I'm trying to express with the numbers below :
1 engi = 100.0% = 100/1 = 100 2 engis = 70.7% = 141/2 = 100 + 41 3 engis = 57.7% = 173/3 = 100 + 41 + 32 4 engis = 50.0% = 200/4 = 100 + 41 + 32 + 27 5 engis = 44.7% = 224/5 = 100 + 41 + 32 + 27 + 24
well.. some explanation would help I guess :
Your first engi works at 100% of his ability. If you add a second engi they both work at 71% of the combined ability or (71% * ability *2) = (142% * ability). Now you can write this differently. Assuming you want your first engi to be 100% efficient still  the second one is only (142%100%)=42% efficient. So :
1st engi = 100% 2nd engi = 42% 3rd engi = 32% 4th engi = 27% 5th engi = 24%
So a 5th engi appears to be working at less then a quarter of his ability only  for speed freaks only.
Now to make it clear again  this last part is not the way overheat speed is calculated! It is only another way to interpret the formula if you have engis of the same ability.


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:20 PST
normpearii

***NOTE Bomber ability no longer is used on fighters***
***The following lines marked with "***” infront of them are no longer valid the current game.***
*** However game mechanics still works this way***
***Both sides of “2000  2000” are now controlled by a single “Fighter” Stat***
***Same method of determining the winner, the great value kills the most ***
*** Aircraft Ability has been reactivated as “Observer”***
***”Observer” is currently used on scouts to do what “Fighter” and “Bomber” did in the past.***
[QUOTE=Adalbert]
Since the fix of bugged abilities will probably never come, although it was presented by me some 2.5 years ago with several, allready coded, proposed fixes  here's just a short overview of how it is now (and was for as long as the game has caps)
9) aircraft ======= **This is a not activated ability  it has NO EFFECT WHATSOEVER on anything related to **pilots.
10) fighter ======= **The true Fighter ability is responsible for how well your pilots in their planes can **attack other planes. It works the exact same for scouts, fighters, bombers or even **transport aircraft. It is just one of the two parts in the additive aircraft
*** Bombers and Transports use “Bomber” ability for all stats, Scouts use Observer***
attackformula, the other part consists of aircraft stats. Only the sum is capped and level dependent so this explains why high level pilots do just as well in lower tier planes as in higher ones... (speed of planes and the flawed way of calculating the distance for attacks of planes is the other reason)
11) bomber ======== **Bomber ability is the only ability that is responsible for resistance against enemy fire  **both AAW and gunfire from Fighter (or other) planes. Again  for scouts, fighters as well **as bombers.
***AAW Resistance is controlled by “Fighter” ability for Fighters***
***AAW Resistance is controlled by “Observer” ability for Scouts***
***AAW Resistance is controlled by “Bomber” ability for Bombers and Transport***
Some examples on the effect of the abilities without going into detail with the numbers  that's not my job. (lvl120 pilots with a fix number of vets and experts in the same planes) **Pilot number (displayed fighter ability  displayed bomber ability) < , > or = second pilot
***Both sides of “2000  2000” are now controlled by a single “Fighter” Stat***
FP1 (2000  2000) = FP2 (2000  2000) obvious, isn't it? FP3 (2000  0) < FP4 (2000 1000) still... FP3 (2000  0) = FP5 ( 0  2000) what one plane lacks in attack, the other lacks in defence. None will be shot down. FP4(3000  1000) < FP6(1000  3000) ha! Indeed the difference in resistance is more pronounced then the attack difference  due to the cap and nonlinearity of the first part of the equation.
**Taking all this into account  you want true bomber ability on all your pilots  as much **as possible!! A high fighter stat is nice and important too but its effect become less **pronouced at a higher level. By not classing your pilots above the minimum class, you not **only keep more growth in bomber ability, you also keep the increased crew growth, which in **fact gives you even more fighter ability as well. A nonclassed "Fighter pilot" will beat a similar **(same crew composition and base stats) "Ace" or "SQLdr" hands down every single time.
***They somewhat did what he ask to be done in the following paragraph***
All that is only valid right now and was in the past of course. If someone ever decides to follow one of my bugfixes, it'll all change to the way it is supposed to be and any sane person would think it is.
That's probably the last thing I'm posting here  take it for what it is, use it as a rough guide to setup crew but don't take the game too seriously. And no matter how 'perfectly adjusted' your crew is  it has nothing to do with the fun you should have in game. There are many things that are not even mentioned here in my posts, including numbers of caps, nation bonuses, inverse effects due to ability overflows and so on. I do not intend to cover those as it would be almost endless and only frustrating, so please do not even ask me.
Adalbert out.
[/QUOTE]


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 07:20 PST
normpearii

[QUOTE=Adalbert]
12) Special sailors =============
Due to popular demand  Some Submarine stuff :
** A ** Sonarrange (Sonarmen)
 Only Sonarmen contribute to the range of sight while submerged  They only work in support slots  Sonarmen do NOT stack at all. The sonarman in the sternmost Sslot contributes only ** UPDATE March 2nd : The sonarman with the most true ability contributes now **  Sonarrange is only dependent on the sonarman's true potential ability. No other sailor, ability, ship, nation, FCS or anything else plays a role.
I will talk of Tactical Sonarrange (TSR) in 'ticks' of guidelines. It describes the distance from the center of your ship to an enemy ship at which you will see it 'in color'. TSR1.0 is the distance between two major tickmarks on your guidelines  no matter in which zoom you look at it. The real sonarrange  at which you will see the shades of ships  is greater then the TSR by 3.0 as long as you have a sonarman on board.
The TSR of a submarine without a Sonarman on board is 3.0 As soon as a sonarman is on board, it 'jumps' up to 9.25, even if he has 0 recruits and/or 0 ability. To get further TSR, you need more true potential ability on your sonarman.
TSR 9.25 > 0 TSR 10.5 > 620k TSR 11.75 > 1160k TSR 13.0 > 2130k
It will hardly be possible to go above that, since it requires an ability far beyond 3mil and even an elite BO at lvl120, classed as Sonarman doesn't get there with a 'normal' amount of vets.
** B ** Compressed air reload (Planesmen)
 only planesmen decrease the time required for reload your compressed air  they only work in supportslots  planesmen do not stack (just like sonarmen) and if you mount more then one nonetheless, the one with the higher true ability contributes only  Compressed air reload is only dependent on the planesman's true potential ability. No other sailor, ability, ship, nation or anything else plays a role.  Planesmen only work if they have more then 90% of their recruits filled up. If you start with less, then not only will your airgauge be empty at start, but you will refill your air at the rate as if you had no planesman aboard at all  there appears to be no cap
Now the reload time :
With no planesman, one with 0 ability or one with less then 90% recruits you will have a 'basereload' time of 4min and 30 seconds. As soon as you have an effective planesman, following formula describes the compressed air reload time :
T(rel) = 112  20 * (true ability/10^6) [seconds]
Pretty easy actually : 50k true ability per second faster reload  here are some examples :
(IJN Planesman +14 potential base, 100 vets, full experts, classed on time, boosted) lvl44 (500k) > 102 seconds lvl67 (1mil) > 92 seconds lvl97 (2mil) > 72 seconds lvl120 (3mil) > 52 seconds
a lvl30 Planesman with 0 vets and 1 expert would reload in 112 seconds where the same Planesman with 0 vets and 0 experts needs the full 270 seconds.
[/QUOTE]


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 12. 2012 22:42 PST
hammershot

Originally Posted by normpearii
Originally Posted by normpearii
Hey norm, great repost of adalberts guides. How accurate do u think that repair rate graph is?


Re : Temp Repost: Adalbert's guides on ability
05. 13. 2012 00:10 PST
AlexCaboose



