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  • Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 06. 2013 20:48

Recommend : 65

fromage

This suggestion is simple and straightforward.

 

Fact: 100% of all BB players who use a ship that can scout, should scout.  While there are a number of reasons a player may choose not to carry a scout, the general consensus of the community is that this is unacceptable.

 

I have the personal opinion that the average skill level of the player base has been declining steadily since the release of the game.  In order to combat this and keep the game as competitive and enjoyable as possible I have put together this proposal, as well as an accompanying picture to illustrate what I'm suggesting.  I'm proposing that every BB have a dedicated scout slot in place of one of the support slots.  Please refer to the picture below.

 

 

Continuing, I'm suggesting that only scout pilots may be placed in this slot.  Here is a specific list of which sailor classes would be allowed in this slot:

 

  • Rookie Pilot
  • Recon Pilot
  • ACE Recon Pilot

 

This slot would act similarly to the BO slot, in terms of coding and/or restrictions.  Every BB which can carry a scout would have one of the support slots changed accordingly (this may be a good opportunity to add scouts to the remaining few BBs, just saying).  If a player so chooses he/she may leave the slot empty, however that would be pointless.

 

I feel this will benefit the community in several ways.  Scouting will become essentially mandatory.  Inexperienced, misguided, and ignorant players will be forced to learn how to rotate their supports during the grind to L120, which is helping them in the long run. New BB users and beginners will learn right away that scouting is expected, and will get into the habit early on.  If this is implemented, the arena will become both more competitive and more enjoyable for all players; players will see more of the action, be more able to contribute to the team due to an increase in the average number of scouts in the air, and there will be less whining/arguing between CVs and BBs over whose job it is to provide a field of vision.

 

Feedback is welcomed.

 

Fromage

 

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 02:27


fromage

Originally Posted by joris92

I agree with pictwarrior. We should be able to build our own ship.
I am not afraid to admit that I sometimes don't use a scout on my Vittorio Venetio (WaW), because I am leveling other things on it and I don't feel like it adds something during the 5 minut battle.
I am thankfull that other people scout for me. 
Sometimes I help them by winning the round, giving them fightercover, blinding the other team or scouting, and other times they help me by scouting a couple of times for me when I want to lvl my crews fast :)

Thanks for your input.  I personally think you're lucky more players don't share your thoughts, lest you would have a much harder time winning games.  Not being able to see trumps all other challenges in a game, save for having no guns/ammo (and SDE addressed that by making it a requirement on BBs).  This suggestion does not take away a significant level of customization from the game.  There's no reason you couldn't sacrifice an engineer or repairman slot for the same purpose, especially if you're so willing to give up your control of sight in battle.  CVs could also be used for this purpose if you were willing to sacrifice support/pilot slots.  Your response is an example of the misperception that's becoming increasingly common- "the scout is the least important sailor so if I'm going to sacrifice a sailor for the sake of leveling, it should be him."  It is that perception this suggestion intends to address.

I reiterate, the purpose of this suggestion is to add structure to basic fundamentals with the long-term goal of improving player performance and satisfaction.

In the real world, the most successful organizations strike a good balance between structure and freedom.  While dictatorship is inefficient and undesirable, so is anarchy.  I understand that people hate the sensation of being guided or controlled, but there are instances where it benefits the common good.  In relation to the metaphor, this would increase the guidance structure from:

BO + Gunners + Guns + Ammo --> BO + Gunners + Scout + Guns + Ammo.

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 11:48


joris92

Originally Posted by fromage

Originally Posted by joris92

I agree with pictwarrior. We should be able to build our own ship.
I am not afraid to admit that I sometimes don't use a scout on my Vittorio Venetio (WaW), because I am leveling other things on it and I don't feel like it adds something during the 5 minut battle.
I am thankfull that other people scout for me. 
Sometimes I help them by winning the round, giving them fightercover, blinding the other team or scouting, and other times they help me by scouting a couple of times for me when I want to lvl my crews fast :)

Thanks for your input.  I personally think you're lucky more players don't share your thoughts, lest you would have a much harder time winning games.  Not being able to see trumps all other challenges in a game, save for having no guns/ammo (and SDE addressed that by making it a requirement on BBs).  This suggestion does not take away a significant level of customization from the game.  There's no reason you couldn't sacrifice an engineer or repairman slot for the same purpose, especially if you're so willing to give up your control of sight in battle.  CVs could also be used for this purpose if you were willing to sacrifice support/pilot slots.  Your response is an example of the misperception that's becoming increasingly common- "the scout is the least important sailor so if I'm going to sacrifice a sailor for the sake of leveling, it should be him."  It is that perception this suggestion intends to address.

I reiterate, the purpose of this suggestion is to add structure to basic fundamentals with the long-term goal of improving player performance and satisfaction.

In the real world, the most successful organizations strike a good balance between structure and freedom.  While dictatorship is inefficient and undesirable, so is anarchy.  I understand that people hate the sensation of being guided or controlled, but there are instances where it benefits the common good.  In relation to the metaphor, this would increase the guidance structure from:

BO + Gunners + Guns + Ammo --> BO + Gunners + Scout + Guns + Ammo.



As I stated I said I was thankfull for those few battles without a scout where other people scouted for me.
As I stated I was lvling other things on it, this will make my extra repairman/engineer much more of a value than my scout. So this will make my ship way more useful than it would have been with a scout.

This topic looks like wanting to forbid a 2 gun Lion 2, let's be honest, it's useless in battles where you can't do tactics with mates. Three guns is far better. I don't really care about their decision to go 2 guns only and that's the same for having no scout. 

I understand your problem very well, but I don't agree on taking the problem away with a dedicated scout slot. People got lazy (skilllevel drop), because of all the events, not because some of them don't have a scout.

I try to help people so now and than, but usually they ignore me or they think that I am making fun of them. I think the player who I am trying to help should think beyond that.

Greetz Joor

P.S.: Since you want a scout so badly, than use one and scout for yourself. I don't see the badside of this..

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 14:15


fromage

Originally Posted by joris92

Originally Posted by fromage

Originally Posted by joris92

I agree with pictwarrior. We should be able to build our own ship.
I am not afraid to admit that I sometimes don't use a scout on my Vittorio Venetio (WaW), because I am leveling other things on it and I don't feel like it adds something during the 5 minut battle.
I am thankfull that other people scout for me. 
Sometimes I help them by winning the round, giving them fightercover, blinding the other team or scouting, and other times they help me by scouting a couple of times for me when I want to lvl my crews fast :)

Thanks for your input.  I personally think you're lucky more players don't share your thoughts, lest you would have a much harder time winning games.  Not being able to see trumps all other challenges in a game, save for having no guns/ammo (and SDE addressed that by making it a requirement on BBs).  This suggestion does not take away a significant level of customization from the game.  There's no reason you couldn't sacrifice an engineer or repairman slot for the same purpose, especially if you're so willing to give up your control of sight in battle.  CVs could also be used for this purpose if you were willing to sacrifice support/pilot slots.  Your response is an example of the misperception that's becoming increasingly common- "the scout is the least important sailor so if I'm going to sacrifice a sailor for the sake of leveling, it should be him."  It is that perception this suggestion intends to address.

I reiterate, the purpose of this suggestion is to add structure to basic fundamentals with the long-term goal of improving player performance and satisfaction.

In the real world, the most successful organizations strike a good balance between structure and freedom.  While dictatorship is inefficient and undesirable, so is anarchy.  I understand that people hate the sensation of being guided or controlled, but there are instances where it benefits the common good.  In relation to the metaphor, this would increase the guidance structure from:

BO + Gunners + Guns + Ammo --> BO + Gunners + Scout + Guns + Ammo.



So this will make my ship way more useful than it would have been with a scout.

This is what I disagree with, and one motivation in creating this suggestion.

Originally Posted by Joris92
This topic looks like wanting to forbid a 2 gun Lion 2, let's be honest, it's useless in battles where you can't do tactics with mates. Three guns is far better. I don't really care about their decision to go 2 guns only and that's the same for having no scout.

That is an inaccurate comparison.  With this, you will still have every ability to put pilots in BB support slots or whatever it is you do.  Forbidding various gun setups would be outright wrong, and would set a dangerous precedent for the future of the game.

I'm not sure what you meant with your PS, but I scout every game.  Realize it's not the effort of a few, but an entire team, that provides successful scouting.  Your team will have the greatest possible chance of winning when all enemy ships are visible, and that naturally requires multiple scouts constantly running.  By that token, I consider it vital- moreso than reps and engineers.

If you want to agree to disagree, that is fine.  Thanks for your feedback.

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 14:28


Rehor

Originally Posted by PictWarrior1
1:  A ship setup is up to the player that runs it.  Quit trying to tell people how to run their ship.  I run with a scout, but that's my choice.


Don't you see?  This mind-set IS the problem!

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 20:59


Happymeal2

Originally Posted by Rehor

Originally Posted by PictWarrior1
1:  A ship setup is up to the player that runs it.  Quit trying to tell people how to run their ship.  I run with a scout, but that's my choice.


Don't you see?  This mind-set IS the problem!


The problem is not the mindset of those who refuse to run scouts because they can set up their ship however they want. The problem is that of the people who refuse to run scouts because they expect others to scout for them. The first group tend not to complain about blindness, so this is not so bad. The second... all they do is complain about it.

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 19. 2013 21:16


joris92

Originally Posted by Happymeal2

Originally Posted by Rehor

Originally Posted by PictWarrior1
1:  A ship setup is up to the player that runs it.  Quit trying to tell people how to run their ship.  I run with a scout, but that's my choice.


Don't you see?  This mind-set IS the problem!


The problem is not the mindset of those who refuse to run scouts because they can set up their ship however they want. The problem is that of the people who refuse to run scouts because they expect others to scout for them. The first group tend not to complain about blindness, so this is not so bad. The second... all they do is complain about it.



+1 to you. 

@ the others I am fully aware of what I am doing when I don't equip my scout... Out of the battles I played with BB it's far less than 1% of which I played without a scout, besides it's usually only in WaW... There are more skilled players in Blitzkrieg than in those rooms...

Besides that I found it more annoying that people don't even try to dodge your shells, it's no fun. I should have made a screenshot of it and posted it on the forum to show you guys how sad it is. 380k attack and I still lost the battle... (GBII with L2) =') 

I am sorry for my previous bad comparison, but that is how I look at this topic. 

Greetz Joor

You know I love you fromage, if you think this would make people tend to dodge more than Ill recc it for you. The only thing I expect from this atm is that people will, I am sorry, that more people will launch their scout at default altitude into the fighters or AA. 

P.S.: Do you have any idea how many games I lose with my lvl 120 German FW cv with scout nowadays than when I did 2 years back? I can tell you that I stopped playing my CV and now lvl my new fighters + SM on my VV in WaW... :P

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 20. 2013 00:33


fromage

Originally Posted by joris92

Originally Posted by Happymeal2

Originally Posted by Rehor

Originally Posted by PictWarrior1
1:  A ship setup is up to the player that runs it.  Quit trying to tell people how to run their ship.  I run with a scout, but that's my choice.


Don't you see?  This mind-set IS the problem!


The problem is not the mindset of those who refuse to run scouts because they can set up their ship however they want. The problem is that of the people who refuse to run scouts because they expect others to scout for them. The first group tend not to complain about blindness, so this is not so bad. The second... all they do is complain about it.



You know I love you fromage, if you think this would make people tend to dodge more than Ill recc it for you. The only thing I expect from this atm is that people will, I am sorry, that more people will launch their scout at default altitude into the fighters or AA.

Well at the very least I expect it to make people more aware of what they're doing, which in turn will make the game more competitive.  Thanks Joris.

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 20. 2013 09:10


Mezak76

This is an very interesting thread, started by formage and refered only to scout matter.
 
As Happymeal2 said: "....The problem is that of the people who refuse to run scouts because they expect others to scout for them. The first group tend not to complain about blindness, so this is not so bad. The second... all they do is complain about it.." Anoying group of people that one, the selfish.
Most of those BBS (Big Boat Starts) really believe that only because have a high tier battleship or a 120 LVL crew all other players are to serve them. That´s a lie.

Most players don´t even run thier ships with AA. The main argument for that is " XX nation AA is crap". TOTAL LIE.
Actually reach L2, and use UK AA. With that "crap" AA I was able to wipe out a entire squad of DB in 5 shots. I that a crap?. Which is the reason to for use then against all commets?. To support others BB while I´m repairing.
Instead of use the mouse to look arround and sitck the other finger in the nose is better to kill some scouts, time to time.
In soccer, team with 11 extraordinary players that all want to score  a goal will fail to beat the other team with 11 average players that play as a team.

Good night and merry xmas to all.





 

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 20. 2013 22:34


joris92

You chose for AA on your L2 and I went for HH, simply because the HH is more effective than the slow rld of UK AA. 

Besides that I am using AA and HH, both yes, on my H44. The fast rld makes it good enough to kill one of the most experienced DB players and I still got that nice bit of hh against subs :3

Some nations I don't have a pair of extra gunners and yea I regret that. Luckily it's only 2 out of the 7 nations... Perhaps Ill level those gunners later on :)

Np fromage, atleast someone is trying :)) 

  • Re : Dedicated Scout Slot

    12. 21. 2013 10:43


spartan599

I personally disagree with this  idea. I run a BB5 and I run a recon yes but i dont really lanch it due to im more focused on driving and shooting than lanching a recon.

besides I think this should be a player's choice if they dont want to use a recon fine there probably better at aiming without using a recon anyway, and some players dont have a recon for a country to be used on that BB, Ex. I have a RN PBB I have a BO gunners but no supports or recons due to I cant make anymore sailors so right now i only have 1 recon and its for U.S i dont have a recon for Britian or Germany and im planing to go to Battleships for Germany.

 

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