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POLL: Italian BB4
03. 26. 2012 09:46
Elliot2lazy
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This ship is so overpowered it puts subs to shame. BB4 that is the size of an atlanta, that can 2 shot bb6s, and has low angle degree guns. People though russia was OP, but they look balanced compared to ALL Italian BBs.
EDIT: Who thinks it is overpowered? Yes or No
I've tallied the votes.
Out of 52 people saying either OP or not, 12 people claim it is not OP. That means 40 people claim it is OP content.
Not OP %: ~23% (12/52)
It is OP %: ~77% (40/52)
I have written it all down on this google doc. here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0Ak62AhANtRUUdGFoSXM2WTVxdFljeWU2SGFHNkUzSXc&output=html
EDIT: If you think the RM BB4s are overpowered, then what are the traits on the ship that need to be nerfed to make the ship balanced?
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 05:15
captgeo62
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I would probably say that this ship is OP, much of the RM line is, but I also see alot of crybabys around here whinning because they got beaten. The RN Hood was supposed to sink the Bismark,but much to their surprise and a lucky shot (and flawed design), the Hood sunk, buy a much smaller BB......did they whine, no, they got better ships and better tactics. Stop whinning,and play the GAME.
It also sounds like you dont like to get beaten .....so you start crying,not top dog anymore,so whine some more.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 06:44
GrieferLord
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The ship was never fully balanced out, SDE in it's infinite wisdom released it in about a month, we had almost no time to balace the ship and this is what we get in return, we are having to balance it after the fact. lowering the damage is not going to solve everything it needs to be fully looked at and balanced out.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 06:44
richardphat
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Originally Posted by NIborGER
This submergency is OP thing is fail. It has pretty much average subermgency for a bb4. Much less wount be possible. Currently APHC is somewhere at 4000, the maximum is 4500, like most bb5s and all bb6s have. SO everyone complaining about RM bb4 subergency doesnt know anything about the game and should try to find valid arguments and not tell lies.
Beside that, yes its OP but not too much. Basicly its as OP as Stalingrad is. A bit nerfing should do it.
btw the dmg is total average. Yamma, iowa and L1 score more, H39, richel and vanguard do less dmg.
Don't know where you did your math or get your info, it has pratically L2/vanny submergence. Because 58 000*0.03= 3480 or 59 000*0.06 = 3540 which is very far fround around 4000. Nah, not that much OP at all..... Nuking armour at 25, what makes the point of playing a high angle nation to stand a better chance against armour?
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 07:14
ljsevern
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Originally Posted by captgeo62
I would probably say that this ship is OP, much of the RM line is, but I also see alot of crybabys around here whinning because they got beaten. The RN Hood was supposed to sink the Bismark,but much to their surprise and a lucky shot (and flawed design), the Hood sunk, buy a much smaller BB......did they whine, no, they got better ships and better tactics. Stop whinning,and play the GAME.
It also sounds like you dont like to get beaten .....so you start crying,not top dog anymore,so whine some more.
Historical Accuarcy =/= Navyfield.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 08:08
hiroito
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Originally Posted by sacpeja
You guys go on and on about the bb4. I have one and everyone seem to forget it terrible spead and that the shell range jump alot even with. 100 + gunners. Added with the low damage I avg Round 20k salvo hitting around 7 out of 10 shells. At. Best have seen. 35 k with crits. I think they need to make small changes but don't do a other Russian type nerf. If you land a clean salvo u can break them very quickly.
The spread is product of a FAil nerf that was intended to give it more or less balance. When the ship is fixed, the spread will be better. Just that with the current ship, you can't expect it to have good spread since it would be like a mini Queen Fictoria.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 08:11
hiroito
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Originally Posted by ljsevern
Originally Posted by tlui22
Originally Posted by hiroito
Originally Posted by tlui22
Originally Posted by tappo01
Another tip: try to use your brain once in a while. The RM BB4's at the moment have no weakness.
ok, nerf h39's range nerf yamato's damage and AA iowa is decent nerf the lion's armor nerf the range of ussr bb4 nerf the mn's bb4 aa is this sounds good to you then?
Nerf H39 range? Fine, give it 45k+ for each full salvo, currently at around 34k per full salvo. Nerf Yamato Damage and AA? Fine, but give them more range. Iowa stays the same. Nerf lion's armor? Give faster reload speed/ better submergence. Nerf range of SN BB4? Don't know about it, but I think there is an scheduled nerf to this. Nerf MN BB4 AA? Fine, Deliver the "High damage output" promised (Curretnly at around 37k per salvo). That sounds fair to me, but that would require a mayor overhaul of the Nations and what nations have what perks.
you got the point here, this is nation's advantage, so why do people keep saying italy? because they are lazy to grind? well, montana and mn bb5 bascially can one shot any BB4, even a super yamato not with 100% sd, so why people dont ask to nerf its damage? because people are whinning.
Montana and MN BB5's are BB5's, not BB4's. We are talking about BB4's here.
The skill has always been terrible in general. But I guess before the PBB's were nerfed, that content was fine, right?
Anyone that has a clue about game balance and the mechanics of the game knows Italy is hugely flawed, so threads like these are really useful to see who doesn't have a clue about game balance.
I wonder how many of the people who don't want the nerf to Italy are the ones grinding and playing this ship constantly over say, the BB5...
What I said about the changes to the ships was sarcasm. AM I DOIN' IT RITE LJ?
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 08:17
Yoonior
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It's OP.
Few examples.
Compare size of yammy to Caio Duilio. It's like cow vs tiny dot.
Compare degree of iowa&yammy vs Caio. Ridicolous. RM will shoot 2 times and be in other place when enemies shot will land on old Caio position.
Speed&Maneveur.
It's best combo, you can drive it like 
It's also twin to AD... wait a moment, did they got the same mother but other father or what?!
AD bigger than Caio.
Other problem is that it's taking L1 AW on 2 shots. ;]
IT IS ! Tried...
10" deck doesn't help anything - checked with Estrelle a19, 1vs1
If you change your armour deck->belt you are no longer AW, but got 2 towers and on GB's You better sit down, take your popcorn and watch as battle starts.
In my opinion , it's no uber-super-op but it have some many advantages against other nations that in summary other nations bb4's advantages are useless.
BTW about the skill
Even in noob player hands this BB4 can make big mess, but You need some skill on Yammy/Iowa.
EOT
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 08:19
hiroito
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Originally Posted by NewYorkBoy
Just by some of you guys reply i can tell you lack skills..I've 2 shotted L2s with Iowa...I've 1 shotted H44 with Yammy. WHAT ARE YOU SAYING??? you guys have no point..the game is crap right now when talkin about skill level..I've been doing 120k per in the crappy BB2 and my crew isn't uber. Be cause players fail. This the worst i've seen NF skill level. So estrelle getting 450k isn't hard against Straight line drivers who never turn or anything.
2 Shotted L2 with Iowa? Credible. 1 Shotted H44 with Yammy? That is no achievement, KM ships are made of paper and glued together with good wishes. I believe a nelson with blocking quads can two shot a Blind H44 before it switches to AP shells. There is no skill level that could matter when driving an H39 against a rushing RM BB4+ other 2 random BB5s. I've seen people just run away when they see this little ship rushin while being backed up by L2s and stuff instead of All concentrating their firepower on the RM BB4 and sinking it before it can do any more damage. Yes, a lot of players ignore the ship which is why it can cause so much devastation. But this ship shouldn't be able to eat an H39 alive with little to no damage on a 1 vs 1 with such ease. This ship isn't a god, it can be sunk but it is way too hard to sink for a BB4, not even an AW Lion 1 is so hard to sink.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 08:32
hiroito
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As of now, I officially retire all my statements using submergence as an argument. Since I clearly can't understand how it affects the overall resistance of a ship to damage and all the other million things this single stat does.
There is some sarcasm on this post but overall I am sorry for talking about something I don't know. I thought it was supposed to affect the damage resistance of a ship (Along with some other stats).
I thought there was something wrong with this ship being able to take 4 salvos of around 60% of the shells landing (From my H39) and still being green and rushing towards me, but clearly I was wrong, it was all an illusion since it has average submergence (Which means other regular BB4s should be able to do this).
Anyways, I will now concentrate on the things I DO NOW that make this ship so OP: LAZOR GUNS+~40k damage per salvo+hitbox smaller than AD+Easier to get good repair rate+Good range (or just that Lazor guns negate any range disadvantage)+Good/average speed.
All these things make for a really small moving tharget that is really maneuverable. Also, this ship can land 2 full salvos on any other BB 4 before said BB4 salvo's reach the Position that one thought it was going to be.
I've done this many times on my KM AD, I just rush in and keep zig zagging randomly. I can land some salvos while avoiding the Enemy fire then I retreat. The RM BB4 takes this tactic to a ridiculous extreme with it's ~40k damage full salvo.
EDIT: Forgot to add Armor Rapeing capabilities at angle 25.
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Re : POLL: Italian BB4
03. 27. 2012 09:22
Mezak76
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Originally Posted by hiroito
Originally Posted by tlui22
Originally Posted by tappo01
Originally Posted by Bigboss92
Useful tip: Learn to aim :D
Another tip: try to use your brain once in a while. The RM BB4's at the moment have no weakness.
ok, nerf h39's range nerf yamato's damage and AA iowa is decent nerf the lion's armor nerf the range of ussr bb4 nerf the mn's bb4 aa is this sounds good to you then?
Nerf H39 range? Fine, give it 45k+ for each full salvo, currently at around 34k per full salvo. Nerf Yamato Damage and AA? Fine, but give them more range. Iowa stays the same. Nerf lion's armor? Give faster reload speed/ better submergence. Nerf range of SN BB4? Don't know about it, but I think there is an scheduled nerf to this. Nerf MN BB4 AA? Fine, Deliver the "High damage output" promised (Curretnly at around 37k per salvo). That sounds fair to me, but that would require a mayor overhaul of the Nations and what nations have what perks.
Hiroito, I agree with you, if this ship is over power balance the rest. You said a great true fact about H39, needs an upgrade.
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